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 about bill bigelow's article 
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ok, i just read bill bigelow's article and i want to make a few comments before i read his interview. perhaps my views will change, but as of right now, i have a few on my mind that i need to record before they slip away.

child labor = bad. slave labor = bad. capital companies vs. third world workers = bad. everyone knows this. but what are we going to do about it? bigelow mentioned at one point that the children of these third world countries have lost their youth and the ability to play. but thats based on the american standard. it wasnt so long ago that the youth of america were expected to attend school for only part of the year because the rest of the time they were working with their family on the farm, etc... and they didnt even get paid for it! i definitely see a gap between what americans expect from their youth and what other countries expect from their youth. i cant speak for the other countries, but as for america, frankly, i think our youth is becoming more and more spoiled each day. children run around, doing whatever they want with a lack of discipline and with every piece of clothing or toy theyve ever wanted. its a stark contrast to the image we get of children in sweatshops working from sun-up to sun-down. and yes, it just doesnt seem right. im honestly in agreement about that with bigelow. but who are we, as americans, to go in and change the way they do things? america isnt the only one that sends big corporations to other countries to get cheap labor. but really, tell me - if people from these countries (youth and adult, alike) dont do this kind of work, who will? clearly america is way too high and mighty to get down and get dirty. while we complain and want to fight for the "lesser population" of the world, we continue to educate our children in a way that would have them speaking blasphemy if they decided to take that education and go work in a plant or factory! i mean, does someone not see this point of view?

bigelow also mentioned that america isnt losing its job to other countries, we're just all competing. no, america is losing its jobs because we've become too good to do the meager work in this society. if we all grow up and become ceo's or presidents of major companies and businesses, then who will do the small stuff? so if we help the third world countries and get rid of the capital companies and take away the horrible jobs, then who's gonna do them? and what are the people in those countries gonna have left to do? do you actually think america will take the time to educate those children in the same way it educates its own and then allow those children to compete and experience a genuine "american" experience? thats ridiculous. we think we have competition now - just wait until we give an american education to children of china, taiwan, or pakistan.

it just frustrates me to no end to read articles like this because sure, it presents the case that yes, we americans really do care about someone else but ourselves. but as soon as another country will begin to pull ahead, we'll strike them down. it never fails. we can pretend we dont like child labor in other countries, but come on people, we're still getting what we want, right? and those children have something to do with their time. theyre making a small amount of money while our children go around squandering it and becoming more and more selfish and spoiled. we put on a good front because we'd be horrible people to pretend that what goes on in other countries is right and moral. but we're only pretending. you'll read this article, read what i have to say, and then walk away forgetting it. thats what america does as a society - we complain about something for a few minutes, and then we walk away, so conveniently forgetting about it because we have it the best.

sad truth? absolutely. and its still so sad. but what do you plan to do about it, aside from complain? yeah, nothing...thats what i thought.

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Casey McKnight


Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:53 pm
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im not saying dont have a passion. please do. just make it genuine. dont try to fake that you actually care about an issue.

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Casey McKnight


Tue Feb 10, 2004 1:55 pm
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You make great points and you present them so well. This article and your thread led me to do a survey today in my classroom. I looked at popular clothing (Brand and. where it was made)

Mudd - Mexico, Cambodia
Old Navy - Vietnam, Peru, Guatemala, Pakistan, Nepal, Lesotho
GAP - Thailand, Mexico, El Savador, Lesotho
Abercrombie - Peru, Mexico
Tommy H. - Sri Lanka, India

Anyway, textiles I think were the first to go to a global production and to a point that is good..you know, get the world involved so we can boost everyones economy (at least that is how it is sugar-coated). The reason for this is simply profit vs people. And major corporations want to produce at low cost, who cares about the people to do the work. Until this concern is flip-flopped it will be the same. We will support lower costs because we want lower costs. How can this change? I dont know..

As for the "Americanization" or "McDonaldization" or the "Social Efficiency" ...that is what we are doing when we consider child labor. Other cultures do not have the same economics as we do, they do not have the same civil liberties as we do etc...so who are we to say it is wrong (which I think it is, but i am trying to tell you I agree with your points). I do not express these issues as well as you did and I just want to say you did a nice job expressing your opinion on this article and i agree with you

Corrie

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Corrie Williams


Wed Feb 11, 2004 2:59 pm
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Casey....I'm a little confused. Maybe I've read what you wrote wrong, but when I read this article I thought it was great. I was more interested in his teaching style and how he's teaching his students to express their opinions. He's also doing a good job of informing these students of what's going on around the world. I think if children were more informed like this they wouldn't squander everything they had, and they'd realize how good they have it, and I certainly don't think every child in America is that way. "Don't try to fake that you actually care about an issue"......who are you referring to there? I also have to say that some people actually care about these issues, and they don't read an article like this and forget about it. Did you not like Bigelow's teaching styles or his opinions?

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Erin Martin


Wed Feb 11, 2004 8:29 pm
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erin, it wasnt his teaching style that i even paid attention to. i was just in a "mood" i guess and was rubbed the wrong way by what he was even talking about (child labor & poor working conditions in third world countries). i mean, its great that he's trying to get his students to think this way and for that to be passed to a future generation is very admirable. but what about bigelow himself? what is he doing besides raising awareness? he's continuing to live in his moderately comfortable life while he teaches. if he's so concerned about such a topic to pass it on to his students, why doesnt he personally do something about it? if he's really so passioned by it, he could move over there and work along side the children, trying to change their lives directly. it just seems his interest is a little less than real because the only thing he's doing is telling other people (his students) about problems elsewhere. some may call that activism. but i think true activists also deal first hand with the people and/or causes they are "campaigning"/working for.

personally, as a teacher, im not going to present inflated facts about poor conditions in other countries to my students just to make them feel guilty unless i have firsthand knowledge of a condition and i can tell them exactly what i know it's like. has bigelow been to taiwan or pakistan to see how bad it is? my impression was no. i mean, its one thing to have a stance or view about something based on what you've heard from media, etc... but it's a much different story to impress those ideas and views on a classroom of students when they should be able to make their own views based on what they interpret, not what their teacher interprets. perhaps its just an ethical issue i have personally. but yeah, i still dont like what he did. four stars for the creative way of presenting a topic in a classroom, though.

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Casey McKnight


Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:40 pm
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I understand what you are saying about child labor. It really wasn't that long ago that the youth of America was working on farms and in sweat shops. And it is what America usually does to assume that what is right for us is right for everybody. However, I really think some people care about what is going on in other counties concerning child labor. I read an article not too long ago about college students protesting a clothing shop that sold shirts with the college logo on, that was produced by child labor. I forget which town it was...But that not the issue. I think that everyone should make it a point to be aware of the things that are going on in other countries, but unfortunatly you are right about a lot of people. They know its going on, but it does not affect them to the point of doing anything about it.
I understand your frustration, but I think the only positive thing we can do is make our individual self better. We cannot change the world but we are in control of what we do as individuals :)

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Sarah Gentry


Wed Feb 11, 2004 10:41 pm
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So should everybody leave their students in the dark about issues just because they haven't visited a country and seen what it's like? If somebody doesn't inform these children, who will? Should I not tell students that the Grand Canyon is an incredible National Park if I've only seen it in pictures? If I were to only teach my students things that I had seen or experienced firsthand, chances are they wouldn't learn hardly anything. If he's teaching children about this, he may not have time to go over there and experience it himself, and maybe he isn't even in the financial situation to be able to do that. The point of teaching these issues isn't to make the students feel guilty, it's to make them aware and hopefully they can make a difference one day. The first steps to solving a problem are recognizing that there is a problem and informing people of the problem.

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Erin Martin


Thu Feb 12, 2004 12:47 am
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I would have to agree with erin on this one. I think that Bigelow was doing something really great with his class. The class was Global Studies and the topic he was speaking on was a Global issue. He was taking an active role in doing something about the issue also. Someone has to get others thinking about the issue in order for something to be done about it. He was teaching his students that there are major economic problems going on in the world due to things like "Free Trade," "Child Labor," and "Globalization." He was doing his active role in making his students aware of the problem, so that "Perhaps it might provoke them to take action on behalf of child workers in poor countries." I don't think that he was forcing his opinion on the students, but just making them aware of one of the major Global Issues in the world today.

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Andrew Voss


Thu Feb 12, 2004 2:14 pm
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i see both of those last two points of view, but i still see what bigelow was doing as something different. to me, theres a difference between telling students about something, and then, telling students about something and then expecting them to have the same sort of view that all the other students have. i just dont think school is a place to push those types of things. children form their own morals and opinions about things outside of school - they dont need teachers to help them with that. as for the whole global issues part and that being what the class was about, i still see a difference between saying, "here's a global issue. i'll present the facts. you take your own stance," and saying, "here's a global issue. now it's a bad one and i'm going to give you this poem to show you just how bad. you should want to change things and right now i'm going to give you the opportunity to decide what you'd do to change things..." and thats what i saw bigelow doing. what if one of those kids had said, "well maybe i dont want to do anything about child labor in another country right now"? would bigelow have even allowed that as an option? i didnt think so. but i definitely see how making someone aware of something and actually forming someone's views for them can be confused easily.

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Casey McKnight


Thu Feb 12, 2004 3:28 pm
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I would have to agree with Erin on this argument. I feel that Bigelow was expressing his views to his students and he was helping them and showing them how they can make a difference and show others the things that are happening.

There was one girl who did not want to do anything about it, and had brought her mother in to have a talk with the teacher. The student did then realize how important this was and how terrible the conditions were for these children over seas. And she ended up writing a letter to the head of NIKE.

Bigelow presented the issue to his students and allowed them to express their feelings on it through poems, letters, scripts. He didn't tell them that this is the way they should feel about it. He told them to express their opinions through different ways of writing. One of the children could have written all positive things about sweat shops, if they felt led to do that. I think Bigelow's way of teaching this issue was awesome and that he definitly showed his students the issue at hand and told them to form opinions about it and express these opinons in ways they see fit. I feel that this issue is very important and what other place to bring this issue to students then school? I don't understand what you meant by, "i don't think school is the place to push those types of things."?? School is a learning environment and children are taught many different things. In this case they were shown an issue and they were helping to make others aware of this issue. I think Bigelow's teaching techniques were awesome and they weren't just, here I'm going to lecture you on Global Studies and that's all we are going to do. He brought this to his students attention and he helped them to get involved.

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Betsy Cottrell


Sat Feb 14, 2004 8:55 am
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I'd also have to agree with Erin there. I know it may seem like he was pushing his views on his students, trying to understand things from his point of view; however, i reallly do think he used the most effective method he could in regards to just making the kids aware of this issue. If the man has a passion about a particular topic, he should try to spread this passion. There have been so many times in my life that someone has brought up a particlar issue and, when explaining it to me, seemed to push their views on me. Though, if they didn't bring it up in the first place, I wouldn't have ever been informed. I think if the kids agreed with the teacher and it interested them, his lecture gives them the basis to further their intelligence of this topic. I felt his style may have seemed pushy, but I don't think there were very many other ways in which to approach such a topic.


Wed Feb 18, 2004 4:13 pm
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