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 "We need not be concerned with a decline in test scores 
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In the reading from "Moral Outrage and Education" by David Purpel (pg 257) he says we shouldn't worry so much about our test scores but rather the increase in unnecessary human suffering. I, just as much as the next person, think there is entirely to much human suffering especially during this time of war, but when we sign those contracts at the beginning of the school year, we are promising to teach the state mandated curriculum, which is what we get paid to do. We are held accountable to teach those things, and if they are not taught, we will lose our jobs. Teaching the curriculum is what are paid for. Now, before anyone starts jumping down my throat (good thing this is a computer based forum so I don't get cut off), I believe there is such a thing as universal morals and ethics which the youth should be taught as well. However, it is not our job as a teacher but our duty as a member of society to teach universal morals.

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Melissa McNeilly


Tue Jul 13, 2004 6:20 pm
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Melissa,

You are correct in saying that we are paid to teach what the state mandates in the curriculum. That is our job as teachers. What we can do is teach the curriculum along with ideas of how the subject matter in the curriculum will make us responsible and informed members of our society. Doing that is the hard part of teaching because we all have different ideas of being responsible and informed. This is where the individualality (sp) of our students is important. We are left to inform our students to use their own perspective with the information we give them. Hopefully it makes them more "rounded" as a person and they are able to make better choices if we do our job correctly. I do mean hopefully!

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Chuck Rananto


Wed Jul 14, 2004 11:00 am
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Chuck,
I agree with you 100%. What I'm saying is takes more than just the teacher to teach morals, ethics and how to be a well rounded individual. I think that is the job of everyone that comes in contact with these children to provide guidence. It just seems like parents (not all) have passed their responsiblity of raising their children correctly onto teachers, government or who ever will take the job. I'm just saying that all the responsiblity of correctly teaching "how to be a good person" to all the children in country is put on the teachers shoulders when, it's the job of everyone and especially the parents.

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Melissa McNeilly


Wed Jul 14, 2004 12:56 pm
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Melissa,

I believe in what you are saying. It is the community's responsibility to ensure that our children are well rounded individuals not just for the community but for where ever the child decides to live in the future. Teachers are a part of the community and because children see teachers for a majority of the day (during school days); they are the ones who are being trusted in leading our children in the "right" direction. Unfortunately this is not what should be happening and the community needs to take a stand and say WE are responsible for our children.

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Chuck Rananto


Wed Jul 14, 2004 1:07 pm
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Melissa,

For what purpose is it the job of the "teacher to teach morals [and] ethics"? - to provide willing recruits for the next war?, to provide docile workers for the ABC corporation?

As educators, isn't it our "moral" responsiblity to present challenges to what is held "sacred"?

Dan


Fri Jul 16, 2004 9:55 pm
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I think it is our jobs to teach morals. You have to remember that students see us (teachers) more than their parents. So if we don't help in the moral up bringing of kids, who is going to teach them?

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Tracy Benfield


Sat Jul 17, 2004 7:50 pm
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Tracy

Whose morals? Yours? Mine?

Where is the line between morals and propoganda?

Dan


Sun Jul 18, 2004 10:03 am
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My point is...

I believe there is such a thing called "universal morals", and it is the responsiblity of society whether it be teachers, police officers, cashiers at the grocery store, neighbors, or whoever, to teach "universal morals".
yes, teachers see the kids more than all these other people so we should be models citizens, but Mr President passed some bills that binds us (teachers) to worrying about test scores. It would be nice if we could just go into our classrooms and teach whatever we wanted to, and kids would surely like school a lot more but we just can't do that. I'm not advocating that teachers should not "teach" universal morals or ethics in the classroom. Teachers should be, I guess you could say moral role models in the classrooms, but it should be carried on outside of the classroom.

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Melissa McNeilly


Sun Jul 18, 2004 10:43 am
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"universal morals"?

if it the teacher's responsibility to teach these, and, by extension, to enforce these... where is the line drawn? what prevents us from inflicting our own viewpoint of "universal morals"?

once again: whose universe?


Sun Jul 18, 2004 7:15 pm
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It seems to me as agents of the state (teachers) it might not be a good idea to officially declare that teachers should teach morals.

I wonder what morals the German government would have teachers teaching in the 1930's for instance.

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Graham Ponder


Sun Jul 18, 2004 7:25 pm
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When a teacher posts a set of rules for the class, in a sense he or she is creating a set of morals for the classroom.

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Kellie Coffey


Sun Jul 18, 2004 8:29 pm
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I agree Melissa. We are paid to teach the curriculum but we must try to incorporate moral and ethical issues with that. Isn't a goal for a teacher to help students become better citizens? Shouldn't we be a model for our students so that they will understand the importance of making the world a better place for everyone? We do have rules and regulations for our classrooms and at our school most teachers allow input from the students in creating these rules for the classrooms.

Susan Pope :)

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Susan


Mon Jul 19, 2004 9:53 am
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Ah, the old "better citizens" rears it's frothy head (again)

The better citizens of the Reconstruction era south were members of the Klu Klux Klan

The better citizens of Nazi Germany had lampshades made of human skin

The better citizens of today, our fine federal Representatives and Senators - who voted to send (actually, they were not even that forthright: they "acquiesced" to sending) the sons and daughters of America into war inIraq - have between them: one child in the active armed services (that's right: one)

I feel absolutely and completely no obligation to formulate "better" citizens to the standards of the state - if I have a "moral" obligation, at all, it is to instill in my students the mortal necessity of questioning everything

Dan


Thu Jul 22, 2004 6:51 pm
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Dan,
If we are not to teach any morals other than " the mortal necessity of questioning everything", then when you have student that continues to poke his/her pencil into another child's arm, what are you going to do or say to that child?

You also asked in reference to universal morals, "whose universe"? Who elses but our universe.

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Melissa McNeilly


Sat Jul 24, 2004 10:29 pm
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I think we have a legitimate reason to be concerned with declining test scores as a teacher. It is our primary responsibility to teach. The state, government, and parents of our students have every right to know if we are doing our jobs. There are checks and balances on every other career, so why not for teaching? If we fail our students in helping them learn what the curriculum states they should, then we should be held accountable.

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Christy J. Hall


Sat Jul 24, 2004 10:38 pm
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I don’t feel we should be held accountable for a student who may not do well on a test. We can teach them but we can’t take the test for them. As a teacher I’m going to bust my ass to see a child succeed and I would do anything that I can to see it. I’m sick of a politician trying to get involved in what I do when they have never attended a public school. I mean I can be like one politician and follow along reading My Pet Goat but I think Ill do a better job in teaching but than again I’m not a politician.
Another thing, I dhouldn't be on trial becasue of a student. I've been to college for 4-years and I have done my time. Some students don't want to be there and those are the ones that need the help. Now if I didnt feel like I did my job and a student did poorly than I should be blamed.

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Jesse Tanner Beam


Mon Aug 02, 2004 4:08 pm
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I believe teachers need to be held accountable for what they do in the classroom, I'm just not sure If testing is an accurate way to judge our teaching abilities.

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Melissa McNeilly


Wed Aug 04, 2004 4:06 pm
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