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 School Mascots... 
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So, I know that we talked about this a little while ago and that we have moved on but the more I think about it the more heated I actually get. As I said in class, the University of Illinois was court ordered to remove its mascot because it was a Native American and was seen as offensive to some. We left that day of class with the question of... should we continue to do something if it offends others? First of all, if we attempted to live a life that would offend no one, then we wouldn't be able to exist. Someone is going to disagree with and/or take offense to much of what you say each day. This specific case, however, was especially important to me because it was a part of my childhood. I remember watching the chief in native costume dance at basketball games as thousands stood in reverent silence. Did it offend some that he was using a native tradition? Yes. But what about my revered traditions. Maybe it offends me as a Christian that Christmas has been turned into a commercialized circus. So, I'm gonna need everyone with santa blowups in their front yards to take them down because it offends me. The same goes for Easter by the way. And our most recent St.Patrick's day... if you aren't Irish then take the green off and find another excuse to drink beer because it offends me that non-Irish are mocking it. I know that I'm coming off really strong here, but I don't understand why one group gets to claim it is mocking to use a traditional dance but in other cases it is ok? I guess I just challenge all of us to take a step back from the politically correct stage and realize that there are things that we think are amusing or entertaining that may be at the expense of others- and that you would still participate in them knowing that. I know I am one too, but realize how hypocritical some of the comments we make are, especially when we don't know the same story. So, I understand that this post will probably offend some, but if it reaches one other person that was afraid to stand up, then mission accomplished.

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Erin Nevitt


Wed Mar 21, 2007 10:43 pm
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I agree!! You can't please every single group!! Look at our mascot, Yosef who portrays your typical mountain man. He carries a riffle and the old mountain jug around. So shouldn't these local mountain people be a little upset? Also look at the New England Patriots and any other Caucasian mascot. This whole mascot thing is really over rated and people make a really big deal out of nothing. No organization or school chose a mascot just to make fun of a certain group. So yes Erin I totally agree.


Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:19 am
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Oh yes, you make a great point. I actually had a similar conversation with Dr. Turner after class that day about this issue. There is a huge difference between the use of a mascot to celebrate and energize a spirit that exists outside ourselves and the use of a mascot to mock or denegrate a culture. What about the Washington Redskins? Redskins?? Now THAT could be offensive, but a college team that recreates traditional Native celebrations - that doesn't strike me as racist or derogatory.

Now of course, we have to respect the right of any person to express their pain or humiliation at offensive practices, but there must be a point where society can agree that pluralism is a matter of fact and should and can be celebrated with pride. But, I cannot tell a Native American that they should not be offended; I just don't have that right.

Great post, Erin!


Thu Mar 22, 2007 11:36 am
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I totally agree with everything that has been said. I just want to point out that one of UNC Pembroke's statues that decorate the campus is a hawk given the name "Tommy-Hawk." What's a "Tommy-Hawk," a tomahawk is a Native American all purpose tool but it is most commonly regarded as a weapon. This adds to the savage stereotypes of Native Americans, not to mention UNCP's mascot is a brave.


Mon Mar 26, 2007 10:32 am
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Ok, first of all I think your comments are extremely ignorant . Part of becoming a better society, one that is progressive, is recognizing your mistakes and making amends. I dont think I need to list the attrocities committed by "Americans" on the native population. But, I think the least we can do is respect their religion and heritage. Does the mascot really play that large of a role in your enjoyment of a sport? Yes, it is impossible to avoid offending everyone at everytime but when it is something clearly offensive, it should be changed. Comparing the commercialization of Christian religions to the use of ceremonial Native American figures as mascots are two very different things. The people commercializing the holidays you speak of are Christians themselves. Perhaps that speaks to aspects of Christianity itself. It's not like a university has a Jumping Jesus as a mascot. I would love to see that happen and how fast all the crazy Christians in this country scramble to get it removed. And it would happen in a heartbeat because they have the power and always have. Native Americans had no voice in the past and a minimal one now. You forget that you are speaking from a white-european's perspective. For you the world is limitless and full of options.

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Brandon J Fiedor


Mon Mar 26, 2007 4:09 pm
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Brandon_Fiedor wrote:
Ok, first of all I think your comments are extremely ignorant.


Let's be a little more respectful and not call each other ignorant. Like Dr. Turner said, you need to respect everyone's opinion. I believe you have a great point, but don't assume that our comments are stupid. It's perfectly fine to disagree, but do so in a professional way.
We need to think about how we are going to handle student opinions that are different from ours. We can not just call them ignorant. Listen and learn from those ideas.


Wed Mar 28, 2007 6:54 am
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I think Erin makes some very good points. In today's society it seems that anything anybody does could offend some person or culture. I personally think people need to put aside these things that are offending them. School mascots are not purposely trying to offend a culture. If anything they are celebrating it. It evolves school spirit and support. It is not meant to offend people. I do understand that there are certain things in our world that do offend people and I think in certain circumstances people have a right to dispute them. I think sometimes today's society needs to let the petty things go.

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Alyse A. Bowden


Wed Mar 28, 2007 12:13 pm
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1. Please refrain from calling my statements ignorant. Just because they are different from your's does not make them ignorant. As far as what I was talking about in the post- I don't believe I am ignorant about it because I experienced the mascot situation. I lived in Illinois and yes, it was a big deal to me to lose a tradition that I grew up with.
2. You argue that we should have a "better society" but not listening to other people's views seems to counter what a better society is based upon.
3. You use the word "respect" and then fail to do so in your own post. It is important that I respect someone's traditions or beliefs but you don't have to respect me on a post?
4. The examples I gave were merely examples. I feel as though the main arguement had little to do with Christianity and it seems as thought it became another opportunity to attack religious views. If you don't believe that mascots and Christian holidays have anything to do with each other, then was the jumping Jesus comment necessary?
5. As far as having endless opportunities because I am white... you are making statements about me based solely on my race which is rediculous. I may be white, but you have no clue where I have come from or what I have done to get here. And historically speaking, my Irish ancestors didn't exactly have it made- they were persecuted too. I suppose that Notre Dame should remove their mascot as well??

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Erin Nevitt


Wed Mar 28, 2007 1:31 pm
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Obviously, I have to be the "bad guy"as far this conversation is concerned. Honestly, I don't care. My intention is and was not to hurt anybody's personal feelings. I never called anyone in particular ignorant, rather their comments. I believe that everyone and anyone in his or her life will make ignorant comments, this does not make them inheriently ignorant. I'll admit I have made ignorant comments in the past and I am sure I will do so in the future, it's human nature. So, when other posts infer I meant their comments were stupid, that is totally their reading, nothing more. As far as being unprofessional, I think it will be extremely easy for everyone in the future to simply disregard uncomfortable comments as unprofessional and not have to actually think about their intentions or implications. My goal is to get everyone to think outside of their White, Middle Class, Christian mindset. Please do that, if only for a second and realize that if the situation were reverse everyone would be extremely offended. There is no way to recreate a dance or figure that Native Americans hold sacred and religiously important in a way that is not offensive when the venue is a sporting event. Whose sheer purpose is the excitement of the population. These recreations are not meant to take place at such an event. This would be analagous to having a communion or baptism held during halftime as some form of entertainment. So when people say we should forget the petty things, I cant help but point out that this is not a petty issue for some people. Several posts mention that someone or some group will always be offended. Well, as far as Mascots are concerned, these are situations in which offense can be avoided. To respond to that last post:
1. I am Irish and I grew up in Illinois.
2. I listened to your point and I countered it. If you are uncomfortable that is not my fault, because I was made uncomfortable by your comments. "So, I understand that this post will probably offend some." Well it did, I was and am still offended and disappointed that everyone seems to overlook this mascot issue as trivial and petty.
3. It is hard for me to respect comments that I see as blatantly offensive. This is something I'll have to work on.
4.The Christian analagies given were in response to Christian analagies made in the article, which you seemed to think was a major point as you made your argument.
5. It is true, I cant speak for anybody's experiences but my own. But, as we have pointed out in class, simply being White provides a great advantage to those of color. So I think I am safe to say that anyone who is White has had more opportunities than minorities. Especially compared to a group of people who we confine so graciouslly to small plots of land and defame in mascot "ceremonies."

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Brandon J Fiedor


Wed Mar 28, 2007 4:36 pm
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I agree that the "ignorant" comment was unnecessary and uncalled for. If you disagree with someone... disagree. There is no need to get hostile or attack people because they do not have the same views as you.

I'd also like to press the point that not everyone in our class is from a white, middleclass, Christian family.

And as for the jumping Jesus bit&crazy Christians... that was extremely inappropriate. If you are trying to express your distaste for the disregard of other's cultural and religious practices... offensive religious comments are not the answer.

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Chelsie Alfaro


Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:10 pm
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Damn Brandon. It's good to see some feathers get ruffled out here. My post is one of the ones which you referred to as ignorant - and as bad as I knew the reaction would be to the "ignorant" part, your conviction is inspiring. I took one look at your post and decided not to touch it with a ten foot pole (partially because I believe you made a valid point).

It's funny that in a post about political correctness and sensitivity you managed to completely derail the conversation with a heated response and utter lack of sensitivity! I love the irony..


Wed Mar 28, 2007 11:11 pm
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http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/co ... 48_pf.html

Here is a link to an article discussing Illinios and also Florida State University, whose mascot is the Seminoles.
Everyone has made a valid point, but, I see where Erin is coming from because FSU is my favorite team and if they take away the Seminole that means taking away the famous "chop" that the fans do during the game, which is tradition. I know, it is offensive for some, just saying that I feel where she is coming from. The Atlanta Braves have the same "chop", for those who don't know what I am talking about, so that means changing their mascot too, and the Devils, and the Angels, and the Yankees, etc.

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William Byrne


Tue Apr 10, 2007 10:38 pm
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